“I would like to hear your thoughts about the tribune’s headline yesterday where cohen mentioned the possibility of granting permanent residence here in the commonweath to approx 8K non-resident workers. you testified in congress last month that you did not see anything wrong with this move and i wonder if you still have the same view today.” — Nicky/John Jr.Read her response to this on Oct. 18 (Friday) paper
“all i ask of you is to PLEASE side with us.protect our future.DON’T GIVE PERMANENT RESIDENCY TO ALL NON-RESIDENT PEOPLE! this ideas spells D-I-S-A-S-T-E-R!!!! and this is your statement to the US CONGRESS.that is another issue i have with you, by the way.i like you, BUT YOU ARE SCARING ME.” — Nicky/John Jr.
“Tina, how can you put those animals above your own people?” — Anonymous caller, after the federal hearing in August
Oct 18, 2007
Tina Sablan on the Run...
Below are extracted from Tina Sablan's website. These are comments she received from callers and other people she meet here in the CNMI:
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65 comments:
Can you link to the source of these comments?
done! (or did you mean, im the missing link? kidding.)
I still haven't heard a reasonable answer as to why this spells "disaster". I haven't heard one, because they can't give one. One argument is they'll overwhelm us, the other argument is we'll be short of needed employees.. Which is it? If they've worked here for a good number of years, then they've earned the right to stay here.. your "disaster" statements are purely racist.
And the only animals here are the ones writing comments like chickenshit anonymous wrote. You are a shame on whatever ethnicity or culture you are from. I know that if you were one of mine.. I'd be seriously embarrassed.
was the deleted comment anonymous? ey peeps, stop this "anonymosity." feel free but sensibly say anything here.
This post is a bit inflammatory. I've read the posts on the website, up through a pleasent Sunday morning and found the poster quoted twice to be in the minority. There is certainly at least one bigoted idiot out there, but the majority of the commenters who can write and don't spend afternoons holding signs up along beach road were on the opposite side from Nicky. Get a decent day job and don't try to do Fox news "fair and balanced" approach one better on the blog.
I'm not sure why the title of this post is "Tina on the run"...I think it should be "Tina holds her ground". She is doing an excellent job of letting everyone know just where she stands and what she stands for! GO TINA!
;-) just playing with words on Tina on the run for a seat at the Legislature.
I don't know what the removed post said Rev.. but you should have left it up. If it was racist, it only makes them and their side look bad.
I read Tina's response this morning.. she's right on. I don't agree with federalization, but I do agree that we as a people need to take care of our people. And by our people I mean everyone living in the NMI. If the feds are going to take over, all residents who've invested here should be considered.
"If they've worked here for a good number of years, then they've earned the right to stay here..."
by whose standards? certainly not by the people who brought alien workers to the cnmi's shores.
regardless of how long a guest worker has worked here, they are bound by the terms and conditions of the contract that allowed them to come to the cnmi in the first place.
try throwing a fit over the same thing in japan as a us citizen. it won't work.
some people came here seeking better pay than was available in their home country.
great!
those same people signed a contract limiting their stay in the marianas to a set amount of time (say a year, perhaps).
when the contract is up, so is the agreement.
whether it's been a year or a decade, it makes no difference. a deal is a deal.
it would be nice if the local government offered a residency program to contract workers who have been here for 10-years or more , but that's as far as it goes.
it would be a noble gesture (and i would support it), but it's not required.
Wow, that's pretty harsh Brad. It's funny you used Japan as an example. A report by the United Nations was recently released. Basically it was a list of the developed nations' support for the lesser developed. Japan ranked last. In terms of allowing folks from depressed countries to come in to their country for any reason, work or otherwise, in terms of their contributions toward the development of developing countries, and a few other factors.
Point being is, we're not Japan, we're the CNMI. Just because they don't do it, doesn't mean we shouldn't, it doesn't mean we can't support efforts to do it.
Right is right, sometimes you have to break out of the pack to do the right thing.
I didn't suggest citizenship or any other long-term status was "required", I suggested that it was "right" and good.
Contracts are altered all of the time. In this case, there's alot more at stake than just some perks, or a raise.. there are families and livelihoods at stake.
I have nothing against giving those who have been here for a while permanent residence status, as long as the Federal Government is willing to pay for the additional required services, i.e. more school funding, help with power and water, increased funding for the hospital, etc.
That's the only real problem, is that if and when the new residents bring their families here, the strain on an already broken system could be a "disaster".
I also still say that both scenarios could be true at the same time; say 1/3 of the people affected decide to leave, and another 1/3 decide to bring their families here. That would mean several thousand less workers, along with an increased burden on social services.
i support thee, rick and lil. as for brad, it is funny and at least we know where he stands now. first and foremost, these people are not "animals" and these people work here bound by contracts and that's it. it's been raised before that these people just wonder why this island is under the US jurisdiction and there's no better nonresident program. we dont mean citizenship either.
as far as being fair these people still believe in what's fair and just as far as what the US has been projecting to the world.
What additional required services? We are losing most of our non-res workforce. A concern that's been voiced by many arguin against granting some special status is they'll all leave. So I'm not sure what "additional" services would have to be covered. These guys work, they pay taxes.. I'm lost? What family members come in may be able to assist fill the jobs that those arguing against this claim will be difficult to fill do to the lack of available workforce. Either way, the total population when this is all said and done is going to drop significantly.. it already has.
Doing the right thing often means not following the crowd, or the status quo.
;-) well said lil.couldnt agree more.
from being a chamorro if you have earned your keep, then you should be rewarded accordingly. i see no problem with allowing people who have been here long enough to be considered local, but not chamorro to keep what they earned...from a chamorro
(noni) to the anonymous above... i don't think your idea is fully formed...
Children born to guest workers in the CNMI are already U.S. citizens, and can petition a parent for Lawful Permanent Residence (LPR) upon turning 21, regardless of whether federalization succeeds, or even if the family returns to the parents' homeland.
http://www.uscis.gov
So paradoxically, the longer the guest workers have been here, if they have CNMI-born children, they less they "need" the permanent non-immigrant status being urged by Cohen and Benedetto, since they'll be eligible for LPR ("green card") status soon, anyway.
This false hope of "permanent non-immigrant" status being peddled by Cohen and Benedetto actually increases the abuse occurring on our islands, by encouraging people to stay by any means possible -- including fake sponsorship schemes.
Hopefully the U.S. Congress will reject the "grandfather" provisions from the proposed bill soon, so we can have a reduction in all the abuse caused by Interior's misguided efforts.
Oh, there are folks who've been here for ten years and have no kids.. you're a screwball. "Fake sponsorship schemes". I can't stand Cohen, but you're simply a peddler of spin.
lil,
what i was saying is that a us citizen working in another developed country like japan (for an example) would be laughed out of the country if he or she demanded residency status.
rev,
my stance has always been the same.
i'm not against people being granted residency status at all. i just think that it isn't something people should demand or expect from the government.
if the cnmi wanted to be noble and offer residency to long time workers that would be great.
unfortunately for the guest workers, the contracts never promised anything like a change of status.
people were simply hired abroad to come over here to do a job. they signed a contract. they do the job. they are either extended or not.
that doesn't make these people are not animals (and the person who called tina to say this is utterly disgusting).
they are workers in search of higher income and they got it.
so what's the problem with that? after the contract is up it's up to the employer to decide what to do with the contract.
it works like this in many arenas. so what's the problem?
and why would this make my opinion harsh?
Because it is harsh. In the US, a legal immigrant worker after a specific amount of time is eligible for a green card, and then is eligible for citizenship, that hasn't been the case here. Well now there's an opportunity for those that have worked many years here to gain an improved status.. what reason is there for us not to support them? What reason is there not to grandfather workers who have been here for a long time? Because they came here under the presumption they'd be leaving? Well, after ten, fifteen, twenty years go by.. that presumption by residents is no longer sincere or valid.
When the NMI became a commonwealth, a great many people were "grandfathered". Those that resided here since 1950 were granted the ability to own and purchase land, many Carolinians whose ancestry was not from here, but who came here during the TT were included in the definition of "indigenous" residents and given US citizenship.
What's the difference here? They're Filipinos and not outer island Carolinians?
If federal immigration is going to take over, and US immigration policies instituted, it would be unfair for workers who've been here for many years to suddenly have to start from scratch.. from day one. They have a right to demand that their years of work here be grandfathered under the new immigration policy.
;-) as they say sand, "only in the CNMI." no doubt and no question about the contract being served as is, but as pointed out by Lil, what's is the difference?
what's the difference or should i say vas deferens? ;-)
Rick,
Do you know for sure that non-residents when given this new permenent resident status will be able to bring in family members?
Does anyone know this and if so can you link to where this is stipulated in writing?
Thanks.
PP
(With regard to immigrant workers "demanding" certain rights and/or priveleges.. This is happening worldwide all of the time. There are African immigrants in France who've been protesting for protesting for improved immigration status and national benefit eligibility, there have been huge demonstrations over the past year throughout the United States demanding improved immigration status for ILLEGAL immigrants mostly from Mexico, there are Immigrant Kurds in Turkey demanding that Turkey give up a portion of its nation for a Kurdish state.. point is, there are immigrants worldwide "demanding", in some cases rightly, an improved immigration and/or national status. This isn't new.
They have already overwhelmed the CNMI in just about every aspect- socially, culturally, economically, linguistically.
Also, Brad's points may not be pleasantly palatable, but he's right.
latest version of the senate bill (sec. 3(h)(6) limits family members of the special visa holders who can be admitted to their spouses and minor children residing in the CNMI on the date of enactment.
check with interior for a draft. i'm not sure it's on the internet.
Lil,
I'm no peddler of spin. The federalization attempts and rumors of federalization attempts have strongly motived economically marginal businesses as well as outright fraudulent sponsorship schemes here in the CNMI. If you don't see that, you've not been associating very closely with the immigrant communities.
Nor am I a xenophobe. I carefully phrased my prior post to reference those with children born here.
We as a Commonwealth have it in our power to make things better, and it doesn't require federal intrusion to do so.
For instance, we used to have CNMI permanent residence until 1981, and then in 1985 we amended our constitution to eliminate it.
How about bringing it back? As a baby first step, we could offer CNMI permanent residence to those who have lived in the CNMI 21 years, and have no U.S. citizen children.
Maybe we could even let them vote and be on juries.
But if we follow these dekada or five-year schemes pushed by Interior, it will serve as a magnet for people seeking eventual permanent status, pushing our own people out of potential jobs.
I agree with you anonymous 0962 on we having the power to make things better... but "we" haven't. It is unfortunate. I don't agree with federalization of immigration with the concern that it will affect our ability to entertain tourists from Russia, China and elsewhere, but the fact is, the CNMI has done nothing to assist low-wage earners other than continue to keep wages low. If the feds are going to take over immigration at least support those immigrants who have contributed greatly to this community, in fact, as a population, they've contributed significantly more than the indigenous have. That's a sad fact.
You can "how about" all day long 0962, if it's not done it's not done. Blame your lame ass legislators for that. The fact is, as much as I hate to see the feds take over, it's folks like you and the "what if" crowd that support the less than "what if" congressmen that continue to perpetuate our f#cked up system. So for you to assume that "we" can correct the problem is ASSANINE, as my grandmother used to say. If it hasn't been done by now, what makes you think it will be done. Those that have been treated like shit in our community need to be treated better NOW, and waiting for your "Locals on white horses" to come around is an unlikely wish. As much as I'm against federalization.. I pray the feds will do the RIGHT thing.
And say it 'til it bleeds out your ears.. you're a "PEDDLER OF SPIN" and a peddler of racist falsehoods.
uhmm, that is if US Congress even cares right now, right? yoohoo, over here! Here! Yoohoo!
Let's wait until this bill become a law (if ever). What's discussing here are just pure speculation.
But the discussion, the discourse, will affect the final language of the bill. So, let's not just sit around and wait.
speculations or not, a discourse or intercourse (whoa) is always welcome here. dont you find it soothing?
lil,
first of all, as an answer to your email, i left the office on friday and hadn't replied to your comment YET.
it's not that i didn't wish to continue our conversation, but i have a lot going on fridays and over the weekend.
i hope you didn't feel "dissed" because i couldn't keep up with the back and forth yesterday afternoon.
i like hearing from you and dealing with topics that mean as much to the community.
as for your message back to me:
"Because it is harsh. In the US, a legal immigrant worker after a specific amount of time is eligible for a green card, and then is eligible for citizenship, that hasn't been the case here."
lil, that's great, but that was part of the deal for the legal immigrant workers going in. that was never the case here.
it's not an apples to apples comparison because of a number of things--including that the usa never welcomed these contract workers--the cnmi did.
the cnmi did so with certain guidelines--guidelines that the usa is now threatening to erase and rewrite well after the fact.
that seems a bit unjust (not that there haven't been injustices suffered by many of the guest workers, but i'm trying to limit this to the immigration issue).
like i said, it would be noble for the cnmi to offer residency to the longstanding off-island workforce and i would be all for it.
i just don't feel that the cnmi should have to.
granted, trying to block the federalization move just to keep people out is a "dick move," but i think it was also a dick move to go over the cnmi's proverbial head in a search of a change in status--especially since the usa wouldn't welcome the guest workers in the first place (back when this whole practice began).
by the guest workers going to the usa for the residency change, it's like having a friend of yours invite you to their house for a sleep over and then you going to his parents and asking to move in because you don't like your house...
...and then you bringing your family over.
now the usa (land that i love) is telling the cnmi that it will most likely lose control over its immigration and, as a result, render all of the guest worker contracts (more or less) invalid.
i think that's the shit end of the stick for the cnmi.
either way, it's a good thing for the workers. i think that's great.
what i don't agree with is people saying that the contract workers "deserve" to live here with residency status.
i would champion that campaign if there was some graduation process from guest worker to resident in place when the blueprints for importing labor were being drawn up and that they were now somehow being robbed of that provision.
that wasn't the case.
the rules were simple. people on both sides saw advantages and disadvantages in black and white.
and now what?
i would get behind a legislator who thought that residency should be offered based on working here and contributing to the cnmi's economy and wonderful cultural mix.
that's just not what's happening.
instead, boni (not the pretty one) told the congressional inquiry board that he came to saipan looking for a better way to provide for his family.
he said that he was never promised a change in residency status and that he never expected to get one.
so what changed?
how did he become "entitled" to one?
again, it would be a great offer from the cnmi, but it wasn't offered.
that's just how i see it.
and just to be clear, my life is far richer for having met hundreds ,if not thousands, of off-island workers from the various countries represented on saipan.
the cnmi's cultural mix is one of the reasons i chose to call saipan my home (nearly five years ago, lil. not less than four).
i want and hope for all people to be treated fairly. with this issue, my idea of fairness is living up to the conditions of the contracts as written in the labor system.
check US labor system too brad. maybe there's a light waiting for you there.
This has gone on awhile.. let's agree to disagree (whatever that means).
cool.
in the meantime (while i'm working on the weekend and missing church), come watch the cnmi men's national team take on a strong bunch off all-stars this afternoon at 4pm at the oleai sports complex.
i probably won't be online until later this evening so don't mind me if i can't reply until 9pm or so...
missing church? since when brad? ;-)
brad,
i hate to see you missing the oppurtunity for an easy goal...
Dear Ms. H,
Even in my anonymity, I dislike being called a "screwball," "assinine," and "racist." If we are to make the world a better place, it has to start right here, with a renewed emphasis on civility, or we will never accomplish anything.
You are the one who posts elsewhere how we have the power over our legislators and government officials, and the ability to choose our course of action. I do not "assume" changes (such as CNMI permanent residence) will be accomplished, but merely point out that it is in our power to do so if enough of us will it, and present SPECIFIC ways to do so.
I don't know what particular "racist falsehoods" you think I've posted. If I've offended you, I'd like to know, so I can make an appropriate apology. Please point out what in my posts above has seemed to fall into that category.
In the meanwhile, you can support whichever legislative candidates you think recognize the contributions EVERYONE has made to our Commonwealth (I notice you've seemed to support incumbents not in that category), and I will do the same.
Don't give up on trying to make the CNMI a better place!
Peace.
You've "noticed I've seemed to support incumbents".. ?? Now where in the heck have you gleaned this information from? How would you know who I support.. right now I only support one candidate really, and that's Tina Sablan.
Maybe someone should support someone who is "in convent" ;-) ask the "&%^$&# gay illegals." (trying to lighten up the discussion)
i saw a bus stop on middle road that was similar to the one you guys wrote about on your blog.
this one had the word immoral above the priest part and the rest seemed a little more readable (at least as i was zipping by this afternoon).
bringing the family over from outside cnmi is not a given and in fact a no-no in latest version of senate bill.
i'll repeat my 10/19 post:
latest version of the senate bill (sec. 3(h)(6) limits family members of the special visa holders who can be admitted to their spouses and minor children residing in the CNMI on the date of enactment.
check with interior for a draft. i'm not sure it's on the internet.
lil_hammerhead said...
"You've 'noticed I've seemed to support incumbents'.. ?? Now where in the heck have you gleaned this information from? How would you know who I support.."
See http://mustbethehumidity.blogspot.com/2007/10/charting-course-for-change.html.
Sorry if I misunderstood these posts in your blog over the past eleven days.
Now will you deign to explain how you thought me a "racist" upthread? I hope this isn't a term you bandy about with reckless abandon, as seemed to be the case with Adam Hardwicke, or your spirited and witty views will lose their persuasive force.
Wow, because I asked the honest question of "who is this man"? You've managed to take from that one question that I support the incumbents? You are a dildo. I don't care whether my opinions had or have "persuasive force".. that is of the least importance to me.
I'm all for reckless abandon by the way. Yipeeeeeeee!
reckless abandon?
Racist falsehoods? Dildo?
racist dildos?
:)lol
wonder how a racist dildo would look like? oh well...did you see the election forum for the senate candids?
good question..my guess is it would have a white hood....teeehheeehehee
lol. luv that tamara.
It would always like to be referred to as "boss".
And back to the original topic of the post (sort of).. I would put certain animals above my own people, specifically: dolphins, black panthers, emu, tigers, deer, otters and an assortment of monkeys.
You epigram of civility, why does that not surprise me?
I don't know, why doesn't it?
I also left out an assortment of whales as well.
By the way, Love the name! It fits.
...like a glove with one finger.
I thought Epigram of Civility was a nice moniker, too.
Especially for us non-judgmental types who refrain from personal attacks and demonizing those with whom we disagree.
Excuse me while I go hug a whale and lobby to grant it permanent residence status within the CNMI's 200-mile EEZ.
Some of us have an entirely too favorable view of the "paradise" CNMI in contrast to those "terrible" third-world countries.
Newsflash, folks!
Life in most ASEAN countries offers far greater opportunities than in the CNMI, especially if you're returning with a few thousand dollars in your wallet.
But some of us are just so certain there is no place like "home" (the CNMI), even if we've never been to these other wonderful places. Maybe Angelo can educate us upon his return.
Don't you mean "Dildoflash!"
Dildodrivel.
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